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TOPIC: Britt's Beyond 31023 Views

Re: La-Briut and Beyond! 15 Dec 2010 15:18 #89163

  • briut
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ur-a-jew wrote on 15 Dec 2010 05:11:
Why is the aim simply going further than you ever dreamed?
UAJ: I think I "settle" for "more than dreams" because I don't want to climb so high and fast that the air is too thin to breathe. Slow and steady will bring me to each plateau in its own time (i.e., in His time). I tend to get a little compulsive (manic) about doing lots and being perfect and other stuff that ultimately doesn't help.

Furthermore, "more than dreams" has no upper limit so if HKB'H wants to take me faster I'm ready to let Him. (That's sorta my thinking on it right now, in case that addresses your concern.)

Thanks for pushing back a little. Really.
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Re: La-Briut and Beyond! 15 Dec 2010 15:30 #89167

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A most amazing thing happened yesterday! (I don't think this will trigger anyone, but 'alert' anyhow.)

Yesterday, a couple of weird things happened, leaving me with some physical emotional stress and pain. I didn't want to hold onto so much tension. (Last night was also mikveh night, adding to both the tension and my desire to get rid of it.) I called a neighborhood massage therapist I've used before (yes, he's gay but no, his sessions don't involve any inappropriate "touching"). He was free and I went right over.

The amazing thing is, a couple of the physical pains were really uncomfortable far beyond what I would have predicted. They were also a little more "personal" in location than just a sore shoulder, but he was willing to work on them anyhow. By the time we finished, not only were the pains gone BUT ALSO THE RID-BASED DESIRE TO HAVE THIS 'PLANNED FALL' I'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT FOR DAYS. Simply, GONE.

So, I can now report that a physical cause was definitely definitely related to my thoughts and plans. I was simply hurting -- more physically than emotionally. Wow. Go figure.

I share this because there may be OTHERS in the chevra who could use a medical workup to make sure there's nothing medical/physical going on. Blood levels of hormones, thyroid, whatever? Muscle pulls or hernias or whatever? Stress that's taken root in a challenging location?

I can't believe I missed the signals of a medical problem. Gevaldig.
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Re: La-Briut and Beyond! 15 Dec 2010 15:42 #89170

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Briut wrote on 15 Dec 2010 15:08:


I just told my own yeshiva bochur that we were going to visit Bubbee and she intended to take us on a multi-day sightseeing trip that would: a) be a gevaldige, always-remember event, and: b) require him to miss the first night seder of the next zman, and perhaps the next day as well. He's elected to fly back alone to get to night seder. He said that in 20 years, he thinks he'd regret the other choice more.

At first I was frustrated at the lack of family unification during Bubbee's command performance. But now, I cry tears of gratitude that he should make such mature choices at such a tender age, and think about 20 years from now rather than just today.

Asking your parents to heed the gedolei Torah and install the filter -- with or without a lust problem to fuel the request -- is (as MasterCard says), priceless. Shkoiach.

hey doc!
i am beyond impressed by your son!
flying back early, missing some vacation-sightseeing-chilling-time.....
wow
from any angle you look at it you gotta admit it is a true nachas
and i suspect that it has more than a little to do with how his parents raised/raise him
good for you
much much nachas!
zemms
Sometimes life is like tuna with not enough mayonaise
~Inna beshem ZS

Give, Forgive
~Cordnoy

The reason I'm acting as if I'm pregnant, is because I'm expecting. I should be accepting.
~TZ
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Re: La-Briut and Beyond! 15 Dec 2010 16:37 #89197

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Thanks, Zemmy. I should clarify (for reasons of my own later thread reviews, if nothing else) that you quoted a thread where a kid got the 'rents to install a filter on the TV. What nachas they must be getting, I thought. Which reminded me of my own nachas. And thanks for picking up on that.

I'll object heartily, though, to any thought that my kids' parents had anything to do with his making good choices. We certainly haven't been model parents; all I can try is "not to screw him up too bad" compared to the amazing potential I see in him. Yes, I'm doing okay in that department, but the One who's raising him is, to me, obviously TBGU (the Big Guy upstairs).
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Re: La-Briut and Beyond! 15 Dec 2010 16:43 #89201

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Briut wrote on 15 Dec 2010 16:37:
I'll object heartily, though, to any thought that my kids' parents had anything to do with his making good choices. We certainly haven't been model parents; all I can try is "not to screw him up too bad" compared to the amazing potential I see in him. Yes, I'm doing okay in that department, but the One who's raising him is, to me, obviously TBGU (the Big Guy upstairs).


Never underestimate His local agents down here (as modest as they may be).  Keep up whatever you are doing to raise such wonderful children.
Help free Sholom Rubashkin by giving him the zechus of Shemiras Eiynayim.  www.guardyoureyes.org/forum/index.php?topic=2809.0
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Re: La-Briut and Beyond! 15 Dec 2010 19:47 #89265

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aujamush: I've gotta be honest here (or at least I have the luxury here of being able to...) : I often feel like such a "nothing" of a parent. I can't shield them from the street, can't keep up with their Torah as they grow into giants, can't even remember to tell them four nice things to every 'constructive' (sic) criticism. If I think about what the RBS'O wants from me, I shudder in fear of how short I fall.

The only thing that gets me back on my path is to remember that He's not expecting perfection, and that even the simple job of giving them a shomer shabbos home and an example of what's important in life, and maybe a little role model as 'seeker of truth,' ... well, maybe that's all He needs of me.

And just maybe, on some rare days, I can think that maybe that's the entire goal He's expecting, meaning that my little 2% success rate is 100% of my quota. But really, I feel... get back to work.

Thanks for the attempt at boosting my viewpoint on this, though; I'll try to give it another hearing.
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Re: La-Briut and Beyond! 15 Dec 2010 19:59 #89275

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I know exactly where you coming from.  I am a parent too of many children.  And I too know what a bad job I am doing.  But every so often I go to a PTA and the teacher tells me can we clone my child, etc.  I recently told my wife after she was complaining what a failure she feels like the story of the leaky bucket, that I saw from Yechida, which I will quote here in full:

yechida wrote on 03 Dec 2010 15:03:


THE LEAKY BUCKET

In the very olden times, there was once a great queen. This queen had many, many servants to take care of every task. One particular servant was responsible for bringing water from the well to the queen's table. However, it was a long journey from the castle to the well from which fresh, clean and pure water could be obtained. As this was the time before cars and other convenient machines, the servant carried two buckets - one attached to each end of a long stick - to transport water back to the castle. One of the buckets was new - it shone in the sunlight and it was perfect in every way. The other bucket was older and it had a small hole on one side which caused water to leak from it onto the ground, along the road back to the castle.

Thus, whenever, the servant arrived back to the castle, although he had filled 2 buckets of water, he had only 1? to present to the queen. This caused the leaky bucket great distress. Twice a day when the servant picked up the buckets to go to the well, the older one would look longingly at the new one, “Oh, why can't I be as shiny and flawless as the other?” the bucket would bemoan. The leaky bucket would cast envious looks at the new bucket since not a single drop fell from its new, glistening metal. It tried every possible way of shifting its weight, of rotating its sides to minimize the leakage, but all to no avail. It could retain no more than 1/2 bucket through the long walk back to the castle.

One day, the leaking bucket was distraught and cried out to the servant, "why don't you just throw me away? I'm of no use to you. I can do barely 1/2 the work of your new bucket. You have to walk such a long way back and forth to the well and I leak out half of the water you fill me with. The queen is such a good, noble, divine queen. I want to serve her as well as your new. But I can't; I can't even give her a full bucket of water."

The servant was very wise (sometimes wisdom lies hidden in places where we don't expect it). He said to the bucket, "Look down. Look below you on the path to the castle, the path upon which you leak your water." The bucket at first was too ashamed to look and see drops of precious water scattered on the ground. When it finally looked, however, it noticed a thick row of beautiful flowers - so many lush, blossoming varieties - lining the path with vibrancy and beauty.

"Every day I pick these flowers to decorate the queen’s table and her room," the servant said. "When I noticed that you were leaking, I planted seeds all along the path on your side of the road. Then, twice a day you come and water them. Now, they have grown and blossomed into the queen's favourite centerpiece. She says their fragrance calms her mind and brings peace to her heart. So, you see, you are not useless at all. Rather, you are serving two purposes - both to bring water (albeit half a bucket) and to bring beautiful flowers to the queen's castle


Yes we are leaky buckets.  And we make mistakes as parents.  But leaky buckets can sometimes with God's help produce some pretty amazing results.  So schep some nachas.
Help free Sholom Rubashkin by giving him the zechus of Shemiras Eiynayim.  www.guardyoureyes.org/forum/index.php?topic=2809.0
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Re: La-Briut and Beyond! 16 Dec 2010 02:26 #89340

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Yeah, okay, so every once in a while we get to see the flowers that grew along the way. But sometimes it just looks like we're walking around with a pile of junk on our heads, and taking a leak wherever we go.

Sure are nice flowers, though, eh?

"Sometimes the world's all shinin' on me,
other times I can barely see.
Lately it's occurred to me,
What a LONG, STRANGE TRIP IT'S BEEN." (Jerry Garcia)
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Re: La-Briut and Beyond! 16 Dec 2010 04:46 #89349

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Briut wrote on 16 Dec 2010 02:26:

Yeah, okay, so every once in a while we get to see the flowers that grew along the way. But sometimes it just looks like we're walking around with a pile of junk on our heads, and taking a leak wherever we go.

Sure are nice flowers, though, eh?


Whatever works to grow em nice and beautiful.
Help free Sholom Rubashkin by giving him the zechus of Shemiras Eiynayim.  www.guardyoureyes.org/forum/index.php?topic=2809.0
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Re: La-Briut and Beyond! 16 Dec 2010 15:43 #89392

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oooooooooooh pretty! flowers!!!
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Re: La-Briut and Beyond! 16 Dec 2010 21:00 #89521

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Briut wrote on 15 Dec 2010 15:30:

A most amazing thing happened yesterday! (I don't think this will trigger anyone, but 'alert' anyhow.)

Yesterday, a couple of weird things happened, leaving me with some physical emotional stress and pain. I didn't want to hold onto so much tension. (Last night was also mikveh night, adding to both the tension and my desire to get rid of it.) I called a neighborhood massage therapist I've used before (yes, he's gay but no, his sessions don't involve any inappropriate "touching"). He was free and I went right over.

The amazing thing is, a couple of the physical pains were really uncomfortable far beyond what I would have predicted. They were also a little more "personal" in location than just a sore shoulder, but he was willing to work on them anyhow. By the time we finished, not only were the pains gone BUT ALSO THE RID-BASED DESIRE TO HAVE THIS 'PLANNED FALL' I'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT FOR DAYS. Simply, GONE.

So, I can now report that a physical cause was definitely definitely related to my thoughts and plans. I was simply hurting -- more physically than emotionally. Wow. Go figure.

I share this because there may be OTHERS in the chevra who could use a medical workup to make sure there's nothing medical/physical going on. Blood levels of hormones, thyroid, whatever? Muscle pulls or hernias or whatever? Stress that's taken root in a challenging location?

I can't believe I missed the signals of a medical problem. Gevaldig.


I believe you are fooling yourself, but I could be wrong of course.
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Re: La-Briut and Beyond! 17 Dec 2010 04:17 #89564

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Me3, thanks. I'm willing to let time tell. Would a week be long enough to see if the change in attitude lasts? (Oh, and I forgot to mention the Vitamin B-12 and D-3 supplements. Maybe they're part of the sudden change, too.)

And in the meantime, if ignorance is bliss, I'm happy to settle for blissful ....

I thank you for your skepticism. It's usually been well-placed, it's always been from your heart, and I've always appreciated the instincts. Too bad we don't live in the same city - I'd take you out for Chinese.
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Re: La-Briut and Beyond! 19 Dec 2010 11:36 #89678

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Briut wrote on 15 Dec 2010 02:19:

d_teddybear wrote on 14 Dec 2010 18:23:
but im thinking, Briut for sure tried 12 step calls already, he's been on the forum for a while now, no?
Well, no. I haven't done 12 steps in calls, in person, nothin'.

Anyone may PM me for details on why not, since I don't wish to offend, but bottom line is that I still think my best bet is compulsive posting, some good therapy, and a lot of brutal honesty. And so far, this has all taken me further than I would have dreamed. Thanks to the RBSO!!


My dear friend Briut, in my opinion this comment is, pardon me, REALLY DUMB!!! :

You simply don't know what you are missing.

I used to think like you.  To quote myself, and the guard's response,
guardureyes wrote on 19 Apr 2010 15:12:

oisvorf wrote on 19 Apr 2010 11:27:

The phone groups...maybe I will try sometime....for now that sounds way too weird to discuss this on the phone with strangers.  I don't want to hear mussar shmuzen...I am not quite sure what we would talk about...I guess that I could call in and lurk for a bit to see what goes on.

These are 12-Step phone groups. There is no mussar shmuezzen there, instead there is a moderator who is experienced with the 12-Steps, and they read from the 12-Step literature. The 12-Steps are the ABC's of being a mentch, the derech eretz kadma laTorah. Read tool #14 of the handbook to understand the magic behind the 12-Steps somewhat.


Since I first tried out Duvid Chaim's phone conference, I was hooked by that angel in the disguise of a Texan Business guru.  It is an amazing experience, and a source of incredible chizuk, to hear DC and his cohort talk about their genuinely beautiful to connect with the RBSO and RID themselves of the compulsions that plague all of us here. 

You simply must call in and give it a try.  Don't even have to tell anyone that you are there if you so choose.  But I guarantee that if you give it half a try you will find that it is a worthwhile -- and quite possibly a life changing -- experience not to be missed.

We just started another 12 week "cruise" last week You can still hop aboard right near the begininning.

Best of luck to you

Shmendrick (Oisvorf)

PS I am glad to hear about the nachas from the kids - I have a mixed bag in that area and am learning to appreciate them in ways that I had not before.
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Re: La-Briut and Beyond! 19 Dec 2010 15:07 #89691

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shmendrick wrote on 19 Dec 2010 11:36:
My dear friend Briut, in my opinion this comment is, pardon me, REALLY DUMB!!!... You simply don't know what you are missing.
I am really grateful for your jumping in. Seriously. It's only when I know that someone would say 'you've got spinach on your teeth' that I can believe them when they say 'you look fine.' It's possible that some of the chevra are a little fragile in this regard, but I suppose I'm sorta the opposite. Hard-boiled.

So thanks for calling me on it, as you see it.

It's not enough to change my mind, I've got to confess. (Again, anyone can PM me; a public forum is not the place.) But hearing your enthusiasm for the cause, and the derech, and the determination... well, that's really inspiring. And thanks for wanting to set me straight when you see a pothole in my road.

PS: Me3, if you're listening: I hope you didn't think I was claiming that ALL my work here could possibly boil down to vitamins and physical therapy! I was just trying to say that the physical issues were certainly _part_ of the cause of last week's slips, as I see the scene. It doesn't mean I'll never slip again or that my presence on the forum was somehow unnecessary -- that is NOT the case. Does that help explain things?
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Re: La-Briut and Beyond! 19 Dec 2010 16:19 #89698

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Actually a public forum may be a better place to debate it since then you may feel more compelled to justify your refusal to even try it with something other than stubbornness. Sorry if I'm being harsh, but I know you have thick skin (and I have no doubt you'll grow from the experience)  .
Help free Sholom Rubashkin by giving him the zechus of Shemiras Eiynayim.  www.guardyoureyes.org/forum/index.php?topic=2809.0
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