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Scientific studies show that it takes 90 days to break an addictive pattern in the mind. Start your own Log of your journey to 90 days! Post here to update us on your status and to give each other chizuk to stay strong!

TOPIC: jack-veiter 25310 Views

Re: jack-veiter 20 Jan 2015 19:55 #247424

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'maybe i will find myself'.
now that's scary.for the first time in my life, i will know who i really am?

and more - yes, years ago i made much progress.for some reason, that's wearing off, and i have to learn to be consistent with my progress. i AM having trouble with making Hashem's will MY will in these areas.

Re: jack-veiter 20 Jan 2015 21:16 #247425

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jack wrote:
'maybe i will find myself'.
now that's scary.for the first time in my life, i will know who i really am?


It doesn't have to be scary. Our shortcomings isn't who we are. That's just the baggage that we have to deal with. What we are is our strengths and positive desires. Finding that out is uplifting. But when we deal with our shortcomings it makes rooms for our 'selves' to emerge.

You will love to find out who you are.

Re: jack-veiter 30 Jan 2015 01:10 #247889

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It may not even be finding out bad stuff about ourselves. It could be realizing pain and hurt that we've been blocking out for so long and now finally dealing with it. It could be facing these fears that scares us because we don't want to have to face them. But yoy can do it!
Last Edit: 30 Jan 2015 01:11 by shomer bro.

Re: jack-veiter 22 Apr 2015 18:58 #252900

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sholom to all my brothers in arms. i post only once in a while for various reasons.`i would like to share some stuff - you know, it helps just to know people in the same boat as me read my stuff.so thank you ahead of time - it is this comraderie that helps us grow.it helped me 6 years ago and it helps me now.
of course, i'm talking about myself and to myself.if anyone can relate to my thoughts, that's great.if not, also great.
we have to have patience with the process.if posting helps, then post.if meetings help, then attend meetings.if writing on the wall with a crayon helps, well, you know what i mean.but, as long as we're doing things, whether it be reading books, attending meetings, meditating - whatever, but we're still falling and failing, dont give up! it's a process, and it taKES TIME.depending on the severity and the length of time that we are suffering from the addiction.and it's painful.i know someone who quit smoking after 40 years of smoking, and it took him 6 months - pretty fast, if you ask me.so people who are struggling and failing - and expressing frustration with themselves - of course we are frustrated that we seem to be powerless over this.i think not to be frustrated shows lack of concern.but on the other hand, it also pulls us in further.at least this is what happens to ME.so the answer is to have the RIGHT amount of frustration - the middle road.enough to let us know that our addiction is really harmful to us, but not too much to drag us down into depression.and be patient with the process, but keep working.and be patient with ourselves.breathe and slow down, the addiction wants us to be absorbed into ourselves.i am working on this very thing now.and it's not easy.but with guys like you listening to me, i have more of a chance of succeeding than if i wasn't here.
and the 90 days is a good start - it teaches us lessons that we'll need.but it's only a start.
i wish everyone here hatzlacha from the bottom of my heart and yasher koach to all of you for coming to this forum.you are indeed warriors.
jack

Re: jack-veiter 22 Apr 2015 19:29 #252903

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Wow, it is the first time I read you and I have to say that your post is amazing, we can feel the wisdom in it.

Waiting for others advices from you !
Thank you !

Re: jack-veiter 23 Apr 2015 12:56 #252945

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thank you for the kind words.
another thing i've noticed in my 6 or so years around GYE (my first clean day in 38 years was sept 3 2008 (lav davka the FIRST) is that, for me, no reason is enough to stay clean - let me explain. the following 'reasons' to stay clean don't work for me:
1 - i have a wife
2 - i just learned all night on shvuous
3 - G-d is watching me
4 - the Torah says not to do it
5 - i just read krias shma that says 'lo sosuru'
6 - i'mabout to daven shachris
etc.
if any of these reasons were enough, there would be no need for this site.everyone on here is a talmid chacham.but we addicts have a very strong magnet that is pulling us towards shmutz that other people don't experience.we're not bad (from the handbook), and we're not purposeful hypocrites.and we're not purposeful liars.and we're not going against the Torah ch'vshalom on purpose.everyone here feels bad that they are caught in this addiction.andf i believe that Hashem sees that and knows that. so, if no reason works, how can we stay clean?
answer - for no reason.just because we're submitting ourselves to something higher than ourselves that we believe in and that we trust is not out for HImself but is out only for our own good - even though we don't know why we're listening.hopefully one day we'll be able to see and understand the reason.but for now, we just have submit ourselves to this Higher will and not give reasons.and let the other people - those people who do not suffer from this - let them give themselves reasons for staying clean.i don't have an addiction to drugs - so i give myself a reason not to start - it's bad.but someone who IS addicted to drugs - no reason is going to help.they have to surrender, admit defeat, and submit themselves to a Higher ideal.
in my opinion, of course
jack

Re: jack-veiter 24 Apr 2015 14:43 #253047

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first of all, thanks to bigmoish for responding and saying thank u.
a couple of posts back on this thread, someone said to me - 'maybe you'll find out who you really are'. well, this was intriguing to me.you see, the power of the group comes through again - others see you as you just CANT see yourself - the group is your mirror.and r' twerski himself wrote that he goes to meetings to get answers to HIS challenges.can u imagine that?? the master himself! he relies on the power of the group!
well, i've been thinking of that post to me, and i have a response.
when we were let out of egypt, we went from being slaves to being free.but, we are now slaves again - to Hashem! what's the difference? there is a chasam sofer in the beginning of parshas bechukosai that says the last of the berachos mentioned if we follow the Torah is 'voeshbor motos ulchem' - Hashem will break the chains of the yoke.but, he asks - this should be the FIRST of the berachos - not the last! first you break the chains, THEN and only then, can you have all the other brachos - rain, food, etc.so he answers that Hashem is telling us that He will cause us to NOT see the burden of the Torah as a yoke - but rather the way they're SUPPOSED to be - a present for listening to the TOrah.so now we have an answer to the dilemma - how can we be slaves (to Hashem) and free at the same time? which is it? are we slaves or free? can we be both? the answer is yes, it's not a contradiction.yes, we are slaves to Hashem in terms of having to listen to what He tells us to do.but this frees us up to be the real person we are supposed to be.by becoming slaves to Hashem's will, we benefit ourselves. by being slaves to pharoh, we benefit pharoh.
during the times i am able to accomplish this, I am the happiest.and during the times when I am a slave to myself and my desires, I am the saddest.oh, it FEELS like I am happy - but it's only a dimyon - an artificial image of the true happiness.who doesn't feel good to sin? ayn adam chotay vlo lo.but it's not the REAL happiness.the real happiness is when I am what Hashem created - and we can ONLY reach that stage when we become subservient to Hashem. that's when we become truly free, truly happy, and truly who we really are.
jack

Re: jack-veiter 24 Apr 2015 14:57 #253049

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Thanks for your posts Jack!
Much Hatzlacha!

My Threads:
Glad to be here
Don't slip it hurts
Lions & Tigers & Internet, Oh My!

--"ולא המדרש עיקר, אלא המעשה"
--"To promise not to do a thing is the surest way in the world to make a body want to go and do that very thing." Mark Twain
--"If, when you honestly want to, you find you cannot quit entirely, or if when drinking (or lusting), you have little control over the amount you take, you are probably alcoholic (or sexaholic)." AA Big Book P. 45. Parenthesis added.
--You hit rock bottom when you decide to stop digging.

Re: jack-veiter 26 Apr 2015 04:54 #253098

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jack wrote:
first of all, thanks to bigmoish for responding and saying thank u.

I apologize that I didn't get a chance to post in response, as there were many beautiful points in that post. Apparently ,I wasn't the only one who thought so, because it was featured in the daily GYE chizuk email as well. Thanks for the inspiration . Keep it up!
Handbook | Skep's Tips
My threads:
www.guardyoureyes.com/forum/19-Introduce-Yourself/236327-Bigmoish-tries-to-be-good
www.guardyoureyes.com/forum/4-On-the-Way-to-90-Days/236329-Bigmoishs-path-to-tahara

"Expectation is the mother of frustration" - gibbor120
"Today, damn it! Today!" - cordnoy
"Desiring is not a sin at all, but just a sign that you are not dead yet" - Dov
"We are our own worst observer" - eslaasos's therapist
WDHW!!!

Re: jack-veiter 26 Apr 2015 14:01 #253117

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jack wrote:
thank you for the kind words.
another thing i've noticed in my 6 or so years around GYE is that, for me, no reason is enough to stay clean...

so, if no reason works, how can we stay clean?
answer - for no reason......
jack


In light of your most recent post on this thread, that by staying clean your real self emerges etc, I would think that that is a reason to stay clean.

For me it goes something like this. To fall into shiflus is death, but really worse than death, because death is just the lack of life but this shiflus is the opposite of life. So I want to be clean because I want to live and be me and I don't want to self destruct.

Re: jack-veiter 27 Apr 2015 12:58 #253184

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if a reason works for you, then kol hakavod. do it! when i throw in my 2 cents, i'm only talking about what works for me.you see, i'm a tinderbox.the slightest trigger can light a big fire.you ever go camping and make a fire? those coals are glowing but no fire? just throw a few twigs on there and see what happens.i dont want to make anyone's recovery weaker.so do whatever is good for YOU.i'm just telling of my experiences and observations of myself, the GYE posts, what i've seen over the past 6 1/2 years, being on dov's phone call for a year, reading r' twerski books, knowing a little about the 12 step program, my friend in memphis, etc.
jack
Last Edit: 27 Apr 2015 12:59 by jack.

Re: jack-veiter 27 Apr 2015 13:37 #253190

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jack wrote:
thank you for the kind words.
another thing i've noticed in my 6 or so years around GYE (my first clean day in 38 years was sept 3 2008 (lav davka the FIRST) is that, for me, no reason is enough to stay clean - let me explain. the following 'reasons' to stay clean don't work for me:
1 - i have a wife
2 - i just learned all night on shvuous
3 - G-d is watching me
4 - the Torah says not to do it
5 - i just read krias shma that says 'lo sosuru'
6 - i'mabout to daven shachris
etc.
if any of these reasons were enough, there would be no need for this site.everyone on here is a talmid chacham.but we addicts have a very strong magnet that is pulling us towards shmutz that other people don't experience.we're not bad (from the handbook), and we're not purposeful hypocrites.and we're not purposeful liars.and we're not going against the Torah ch'vshalom on purpose.everyone here feels bad that they are caught in this addiction.andf i believe that Hashem sees that and knows that. so, if no reason works, how can we stay clean?
answer - for no reason.just because we're submitting ourselves to something higher than ourselves that we believe in and that we trust is not out for HImself but is out only for our own good - even though we don't know why we're listening.hopefully one day we'll be able to see and understand the reason.but for now, we just have submit ourselves to this Higher will and not give reasons.and let the other people - those people who do not suffer from this - let them give themselves reasons for staying clean.i don't have an addiction to drugs - so i give myself a reason not to start - it's bad.but someone who IS addicted to drugs - no reason is going to help.they have to surrender, admit defeat, and submit themselves to a Higher ideal.
in my opinion, of course
jack


I didn't notice the main reason - at least for me (and that doesnt work all the time - due to some corrupt thinkin' or non-thinkin'), and that is: my life is unmanageable.

marriage, work, God, family, friends...when i am lustin', they all get flushed down the toilet.
My email: thenewme613@hotmail.com
My threads:
GYE Handbook | Gibbor's Insights | GYE FAQ - Thanks Skep and DMS123456789 White Book | Big Book (Alcoholics Anonymous)

If one gives up at the first sign of a struggle, he is really not ready to be successful."
"Tryin' and doin' are two different thin's - tryin' is hopin'; doin' is succeedin'.
"The right thin' to do and the hard thin' to do are usually the same."


Disclaimer: I am not a cheerleader; B"H, there are many on the site. I am here to change myself, and with God's help, by some mistake, I might even help change others.

MY POSTS ARE NOT WRITTEN AS A MODERATOR UNLESS EXPLICITLY STATED.

Re: jack-veiter 27 Apr 2015 14:12 #253199

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does the 'unmanageable' reason work for you? then use it! i just want to say it doesn't work for me.in fact, after spending my entire adult life (and part of my childhood also) steeped in shmutz, there is no 'reason' that keeps me away from shmutz - the pull is just too strong.
as a side note, i luckily have a natural barrier to sinking too low. so my life does NOT become as unmanageable as some of what i've read here and heard on the phone calls.so, i've never been to a club, never sinned with another person, etc.let's hope it stays this way - i think it will.

Re: jack-veiter 27 Apr 2015 14:23 #253201

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b"h for you
it does - at many times, but i need to work harder at the steps, for one of the main things this addiction does to you is it makes you forget how unmanageable it was the last time.

does it not work for you, for you find your life still manageable even with the shmutz (like someone told me on the phone last night), or is it that even if it is unmanageable, you still fall (which is what im doin' now, but i know that workin' the steps harder will be beneficial).

b'hatzlachah
My email: thenewme613@hotmail.com
My threads:
GYE Handbook | Gibbor's Insights | GYE FAQ - Thanks Skep and DMS123456789 White Book | Big Book (Alcoholics Anonymous)

If one gives up at the first sign of a struggle, he is really not ready to be successful."
"Tryin' and doin' are two different thin's - tryin' is hopin'; doin' is succeedin'.
"The right thin' to do and the hard thin' to do are usually the same."


Disclaimer: I am not a cheerleader; B"H, there are many on the site. I am here to change myself, and with God's help, by some mistake, I might even help change others.

MY POSTS ARE NOT WRITTEN AS A MODERATOR UNLESS EXPLICITLY STATED.

Re: jack-veiter 27 Apr 2015 16:47 #253216

Hi Reb Jack,
I just spent some time reading your blog and I came to the realization that it is a real mussar sefer. Thank you for your posts. I hope I can follow in your footsteps. Would you ever consider speaking with me on the telephone?
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